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LOST - 06x16 - The End - Oceanic flight 815 is Lost

About LOST - 06x16 - The End

Previous Entry LOST - 06x16 - The End May. 23rd, 2010 @ 10:28 pm
Post your thoughts on the last episode of lost EVAH! Spoil away, kiddos.

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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:34 am (UTC)

Wait, I'm confused. (harhar)

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- So...island!Jack died but at least he didn't have to be alone. Right?
- So...is that the place Jack created for them to go? What? What?
- I don't know anything. I have a headache from crying too much.
- WHATZ HAPPENED?!
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From:okaasan59
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:38 am (UTC)
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I'm still confused! I thought the flash sideways place was real but now I'm not sure. Was it heaven? And why was their meeting place in a church?
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:44 am (UTC)
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Well, not all of them died so I don't think it would be heaven. I think it is where Jack sent them when he did his thing and then died. Alternate universe? I dunno. Pick the happier theory.
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:42 am (UTC)
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Yes, emotionally I am THERE. My brain...somewhere down the trail still.
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From:vesperalight
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:49 am (UTC)
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What just happened? I have no clue right now x_x

They didn't tell us anything about the island, rather decided to focus on the sideways world being purgatory? What the? I am so not pleased right now.
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 04:00 am (UTC)
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I don't think it is purgatory. For one it seemed like only island related people were there which implies it was there specifically because island related events and not a specific religious ideal. It seemed to be what Jack wanted/created for them to meet up again. Mr Fixer that he is. And we do know that Hurley takes over the island and that Ben becomes his Richard figure. I think those who survived got to live their lives and those who died went there immediately. Remember Juliet, while she was fading in and out, talked about getting coffee?
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From:comingintoland
Date:May 24th, 2010 03:54 am (UTC)

Deadness?

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I'm just confused about them being dead. So the AU was where they created to meet up once they were all dead so that they could move on to the afterlife together? Then why are Dan and Charlotte and Miles there? And why does Dan remember Charlotte, but none of those three end up in the church? Or are they moving on to some sort of actual life now that they all remember? Maybe they all get to go live the lives they were supposed to now?

And what happened to the people on the plane with Frank? Do they get off the island? If so, how does that work?
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 04:04 am (UTC)

Re: Deadness?

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I hope they get to live the lives they were supposed to. Otherwise why is it a happy place? It didn't seem like a general place for everyone who dies (like purgatory would be in theory), just a place for them specifically. By the way Hurley spoke to Ben it seemed like they did get to rule as Number 1 and Number 2 so maybe those who lived did live out their lives. They arrive their when they die, however long that took. Though for Juliet it seemed pretty instantaneous so maybe it doesn't seem like forever.
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 04:42 am (UTC)

Things.

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A general thought: Emotionally I loved it. Mentally, I have no idea what the hell happened, but that's LOST for you. Ending in confusion? I think we all predicted that ending.

- Kate flying off the side of that cliff. Running to the very end. That's my girl. (And she didn't get an on screen death. So ha all you Kate haters, ha!)

- Hurley getting to be Number One and Ben Number Two. Also, Ben not being good or bad by the end. Just ok. Which for him is pretty good. I wonder if that is why he was outside. He wasn't really part of their group and it was their group that was given that gift. Whatever that gift was. And who the hell knows what THAT was really.

- Whoever owns the game gets to set the rules. I bet Hurley's rules ends in a lot less death too. He was a lot better with people than the others.

- I cried when Claire and Charlie had their moment. I didn't think I would but I did. That must have been some good acting to get my cold heart to melt.

- Smokey didn't get off the island. Instead of being some monumental thing it just sorta happened. I am ok with that. It seemed like when they were born (Jacob and Smokey) there was supposed to be one of them but they were two which was why they ruled with two minds and had all that conflict. Maybe with Hurley as sole leader over the island he sets his rules and it isn't one influenced by crazy moms or warring brothers.

- I am sorta glad they created their own mythology. Can't muck up your own mythology.

- Vincent lived at the end! And Jack didn't have to be alone there at the end.

- I loved Mile's duck tape comment.

- I would have wanted to be woken up with a kiss and not, say, being run over by a car.

- It was a nice tie in with Jack's dad there at the end. I am feeling a little better about it as the shock wears off.

- Ben got whacked over the head, again. If Ben were a god that would be his thang. We'd have a holiday for it and no Bens would be safe.

- I sorta loved how Rose was all "we aren't playing your games" thing. And the whole "Well, it was the 1970s and then it flashed and who the hell knows where we are now". They just roll with it.

- It really seems like if Jacob's mom wasn't such a crazy person things wouldn't have gone as badly for them. It was while she was in charge that she created the rule about the others being bad and her boys not being allowed to leave. Then she entrusted Jacob to that and I don't think it was a real threat until his brother got the black smoke in him and it was trying to escape with him. Then once that happened Jacob had to keep him on the island. It was also her rule that the brother's couldn't hurt each other. It was Jacob's rule that candidates couldn't be directly killed by his brother. Then when Jack became things bent to his will? Is that what happened. And then Locke could be killed. And then Hugo was boss things must have changed again. Wow, now I'm really ramblinging.
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 04:54 am (UTC)
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I like this thought going around:

Everything on the island happened. People died. Jack clearly did there at the end. Other people didn't. Eventually everyone dies though like Christian said. When they do they go to the flash sideways and meet up again. Not sure if that is just a general theology sorta thing or a specific island theology just for them. Jacob seemed to think he could make good things happen to these people so maybe that was it.
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From:chaoticprose
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:28 am (UTC)
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That's exactly the way we interpreted it, H!
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:10 am (UTC)
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I am happy that Kate got to help with Claire. Yay! I am kind of sad it was a really long time for some of them, but at least it was instant for those who died like Juliet so at least they didn't have to wait quite so long. It is also interesting that there were those whispery people who were souls stuck on the island and not moving along like our guys. Not a happy story for everyone.

I think they knew some of the bits but not all of the bits. Like when you write a book you might have an ending in mind or a concept of an ending, but the middle pieces don't have a particular order. When I write stories I generally know what the result is going to be and while I write I can be surprised by the middle and which characters rise to the top and which seem to diminish unexpectedly even to me. It is a fluid thing and as a writer you just have to roll with it. You have to keep it under control enough so that you get to that end concept you want, but not everything is written in stone. We know Ben was only supposed to get three episodes for example, but rocked it so well he rose to the top. The middle bits don't have to be spelled out in order to get to the ending. *shrug* I'm not going to worry about it. I think they didn't actually nail things down until the end of season two. They started to get the networks to agree to an end date and that is when thing started to firm up.

When I saw the big island secret I was all, "that looks like a literal wine cork...Jacob, you doof!"

When Juliet said "it worked" she meant the candy machine trick. Oh, Juliet.

I need to rewatch it. My eyes were blurry through most of it and I might have missed something during a Kleenex grab.
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From:chaoticprose
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:45 am (UTC)
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That was beautiful. I really couldn't be happier.

I agreed with hercircumstance and thewalkingman as far as the interpretation that everything that happened on the "island timeline" was real. The sideways world was a self-created limbo-land where they each got to live out their ideal life before going into the light. Except, I don't personally think Jack created the world for them. I think it was a joint-effort... something that just spontaneously happened because they all needed it.

So, everyone who was still alive when Hurley took over lived out the rest of their natural lives, and because there was no time in limbo-land, it was as if they all arrived at the same time. Just that some of them took mentally longer to get there than others. The "waking up" was just that they each had to be ready to go into the light--I think they had to be happy with what they'd acheived in their "ideal" life before they could crossover. So Ben wasn't ready yet because he needed to see things through with Danielle and Alex and bring them through with him. I think the reason that others weren't there is because they weren't as integral to that particular core of people. Those were the ones who really mattered to each other at the end.

Man. What a beautiful wonderful ending. When Jack looked up and saw Frank's plane fly over, and he knew that at least somebody got off the island and he smiled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it.

Thank you, Lost. You were incredible!
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 12:25 pm (UTC)
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We weren't far off the mark. I think someone here said way back when Juliet was babbling about coffee that when people died that is where they went. Of course we were hoping it was an alternate time line, but this'll do.
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From:je_ne_sais_twat
Date:May 24th, 2010 09:13 am (UTC)
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A book (that I can't find now ARGH) came out before this season started proposed the idea that the Flashbacks were real, all the Island stuff was real but the entire Oceanic 6/FlashForward line was fake or never happened or orchestrated by the island to convince them to come back. It's really all convulted but it makes sense since I'm thinking about it the O6 never resolved or learned anything like they did in the ALT from this season? My brain is mush but I'm going to have to pay close attention to the flashes between the characters when I rewatch but I don't recall anything from the O6 time line being shown to help them remember their real/past life and connect with people.

Also I like to think that Ben wasn't ready yet and he left the church and went to Rousseau's house for leftover Coq Au Vin and helped Alex with her homework. The Artist Formerly Known As Benry Gale is timeless and can never die in my mind, never.
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 07:16 pm (UTC)
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The Artist Formerly Known As Benry Gale is timeless and can never die in my mind.

This made me happy too!
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From:ocannie
Date:May 24th, 2010 12:11 pm (UTC)
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Yeah, cried like a baby.

Initially, when it ended, I felt gypped that the flash sideways was a limbo-type place. I really wanted that time to be "real", for them to know that happiness in their actual lives. But after thinking on it, I think having it turn out my way would have been a cop out. Life isn't ideal and the deaths that happened were real and I'm glad the end wasn't a "just kidding- everybody's alive and great" kind of thing.

I was really pleased with all of the character relationships in the end. I cried at each "flashback" that occurred.

I'm still annoyed that some things never got answered. Like:
-What was so important about the kids on the Island that the Others needed to take them in the beginning?
-Why did Jacob appear as his childhood self to the candidates after Ben killed him?

-And from last night, HOW DID THEY MANAGE TO GET BEN OUT FROM UNDER THAT TREE???

Haven't watched Jimmy Kimmel yet. Saving that for today.

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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:01 pm (UTC)
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Yeah, I think they gave a few different types of endings here. We get the ending for those of us who would have felt cheated had it all been limbo and we got the ending for those who would have felt cheated if nothing happy happened to their characters in the end. In the end you live your life, you die.

- I think the kids thing was a residual rule from the mom who originally ran the island and then Jacob who adopted many of her rules. It seems like the island takes on the personality of the one who guards it and all the weird baby things were being dictated by those same rules of mom's getting dead and baby's being raised by others.

- Jacob appeared as a kid because visually it was pretty cool. The last time Jacob was really happy was that age. Maybe that's where his thoughts returned to at the end of his existence.
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 05:51 pm (UTC)

first thoughts: Jack

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Two things. Jack died. Ben lived.

both of those things made me ridiculously happy. yes, yes... I know.

I love Jack more than anything, but I love him so much I wanted him to be a hero. And golly if they didn't string that out and along and break my heart and I was laughing through the tears when the water started spilling into the pool again. I love bookends, so when he walked back to the place where it all started. The shoe still dangling from the tree branch. Stumbling to his knees (while sitting with Kate at the church) falling down alone. And then Vincent!

God love the animals. We're not alone when they're around and Vincent is such a good dog.

(Reminds me of the deleted scene where you see island!Christian telling
Vincent to go wake Jack up in the pilot... Vincent has Jackdar)

Sees the plane. Closes his eyes to sleep... and I love this show so much.

Because while it breaks my heart--it took an entire season of flash Alt-X to symbolically remind me of what emotionally had happened on the island. So Jack dying... it was for all that. Even if that hadn't happened exactly the same way in the actual Island reality, it did feel the same way.

Oh my gosh, where's my Kleenex box?
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 11:25 pm (UTC)

Re: first thoughts: Jack

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Jack got to do exactly what he wanted to do. Ok, so the death probably not so much, but he didn't shrink from the possibility. It was why he went back in the first place.
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 05:57 pm (UTC)

Ben

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Ben is gonna sit
outside awhile and reflect.
Number Two did well.

Ben couldn't die. He just couldn't. I loved Jack's journey, but Ben was too broken. He was injured and let down as a boy. Made horrible decisions as an adult. Selfish, cruel, manipulative and cunning--Ben never loved properly and failed the one little girl who loved him.

Ilana offered him redemption which he discarded for a chance at revenge.

But still... he's Ben and Hurley saw that. Ben could encourage Hurley because that boy who loved the island and the mystery was still in there and could be rekindled. Not with being chosen but by someone asking for help. Partnership with someone who, yeah, had more influence but who wanted to do it with Ben.

Yeah, Ben died eventually. But he got to actually live first and that makes me sooooo grateful.


Edited at 2010-05-24 05:57 pm (UTC)
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:00 pm (UTC)

Kate

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Okay, that girl totally kicked ass. I found that I completely respected her blunt attitude with Jacob: answer my questions. And unloading the rifle into the BSM? Who cares if it was reckless. That's how she felt and why not try it?

Kate didn't have the same reverent awe while standing in the face of the island lore. She moved on instinct. She did what had to be done. She was the one to run off that cliff. She told Jack she loved him and then left to take care of his sister.

Guh. That's Kate.

And her comment to Jack that he could go into the church whenever he was ready? Kate did grow up. She did mature on the island. And it was nice to see it displayed in the Alt-Selves.

Hmm. It's like the Alt-Selves were the more realized actualization of what our beloved character became. *snuggles*
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 24th, 2010 11:21 pm (UTC)

Re: Kate

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I reaaaally loved when she was all, "the hell" and threw herself off the cliff with hardly a thought. Decisive Kate! If Jack is going to give his all she wasn't going to hesitate herself.
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:12 pm (UTC)
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They made what happened on that island SO important that every person in that church considered it the most meaningful part of their lives – even the ones that lived to ripe old ages.

excellent observation from a nice recap here
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 06:21 pm (UTC)
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Rose looked over to Jack and said, “It’s okay, you can let go.” So that’s when it all started! Perhaps that turbulence was the moment Jack died.

more things well put here

Edited at 2010-05-24 09:50 pm (UTC)
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From:krycek_chick
Date:May 24th, 2010 08:30 pm (UTC)
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Shannon and Sayid!!! Shayid... Their reunion made me happy happy. I think I'm the only person who loved that part liek woah.
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 08:34 pm (UTC)
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I love Sayid/Shannon too and believe she was the one that he always thought of as the woman he loved after Shannon died.

I was really happy about that. Nadia was... uh, kind of not the healthiest relationship...

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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 24th, 2010 08:35 pm (UTC)
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Another good review in which Jason explains how LOST did answer a lot of our questions: here

The Takeaway: When a dog licks your face; it's all good.



Edited at 2010-05-24 08:36 pm (UTC)
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From:stripedpetunia
Date:May 25th, 2010 01:57 am (UTC)
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All I can say after just having finished it is that Sawyer and Juliet made me cry like a baby.
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From:nicis_anatomy
Date:May 25th, 2010 11:26 am (UTC)
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Me, too ;) I watched it three times yesterday and the thought alone makes me want to start crying again :(
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From:stripedpetunia
Date:May 25th, 2010 02:29 am (UTC)

we all live in a dharma submarine

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Okay, brain finished compiling while I was reading over the other comments.

-I was oddly satisfied by the concept of this otherworldly waiting room, by the time it concluded. Everybody all together and forgiving each other. Ready to move onto some new adventure together.

-My heart is soft like cream cheese; I got wibbly at all the happy couple reunions. Jin and Sun's flashback montage made my eyes damp. Claire and Charlie made me awwww. Looking back to previous episodes, Desmond/Penny and Hurley/Libby also got wibbles and all subsequent references to them also made me sniffle and smile. Sawyer and Juliet, though. They pushed me over the edge. I cried. Their reunion was so epic. I had to pause the episode to get myself back under control. OTP you guys.

-Rose and Bernard's cameo made my life. They're Switzerland! Get your drama out of here, you crazy kids, they have retired from drama!

-I think Hurley and Ben went over for a fish dinner and tea with Rose and Bernard on Wednesdays for the rest of their communal lives. And played ball with Vincent, because I think that dog is immortal.

-I wonder if Richard still gets to live forever? He had a gray hair after Jacob died (to go with Miles' silvery Head of a Stressful Life). He did not, I notice, appear in the church, although clearly the events which unfolded were important for him. But he was an outsider, like Ben. He got to live and die in his own time in the sideways world, maybe.

-You know who else is immortal? The pilot. Damn, man. Also not in the church, though. Neither was Miles. I guess if you weren't on the plane/Desmond or Penny, you weren't quite in the club regardless of your experiences or tenure in a flattering Dharma jumpsuit.

-Poetic last shot. I like what it evoked. I also liked that Jack's first 'real' flashback was also on that scene in the bamboo.

-People with a fear of bathtub drains have so much more to worry about now.

A haiku? Seems fitting:

Keep your mysteries
LOST; it's okay because I
see what you did there
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 25th, 2010 03:08 am (UTC)

Re: we all live in a dharma submarine

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i was doing okay until I read your haiku and *long sniffle* okay... that was perfect.

Honestly, I've been a little numb today (since i watched it 'late' too). I've been told the day after is more elated.
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From:bastette_joyce
Date:May 25th, 2010 03:12 am (UTC)

The nuclear bomb was a red herring

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Something just occurred to me. All throughout season 6, I thought that the sideways universe had been created by the nuclear detonation and Incident combined. After all, it created a separate timeline in which Oceanic 815 didn't crash. At the same time, I was puzzled by the fact that things existed in the alternate timeline that weren't a consequence of that plane not crashing, because they'd happened prior to 9/22/04 - for example, Jack's appendectomy, and for that matter, his having a kid! My working theory on that was that it created a truly separate story that was retroactively different from the original lives of these characters.

I'm thinking now that the writers introduced the flash-sideways world to us at just that time, to throw us off course as to what it was. It was perfectly reasonable for people to see a causality there, since they went back in time and changed a major event (9/22/04), and now there's there's sort-of branched-off timeline with the characters living different lives.

I don't know when the characters created the "waiting station" but I don't think it had anything to do with the bomb at all.
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From:hercircumstance
Date:May 25th, 2010 03:41 am (UTC)

Re: The nuclear bomb was a red herring

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Yeah, originally we thought it did something like that because of what Juliet said as she died, but in reality all it did was blow them back to their regular time line I guess. Works for me!
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From:slightlyjillian
Date:May 25th, 2010 02:04 pm (UTC)
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The show has really been telling us what it wants to be for quite some time now, and we feel like we’ve been listening to it.”

An interesting blog reflection on the creative development of LOST.
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